Olivier Rassinoux [00:00:00]:

There is this, you know, we always will say, you know, managers have to touch tables, right? This is true. And how awkward sometimes it can be when someone comes by and says, how are you enjoying everything today? You know, working that into your service element is key and getting that validation or being approachable, to hear feedback at the moment, but then do something about it at the moment.

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Angelo Esposito [00:00:29]:

Welcome to WISKing It All with your host, Angelo Esposito, co-founder of WISK.ai, a food and beverage intelligence platform. We're going to be interviewing hospitality professionals around the world to really understand how they do what they do. Welcome to another episode of WISKing It All. We're here today with Olivier Rassinoux, vice president at the Patina Restaurant Group. Group. Olivier, thanks for joining us.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:00:56]:

No problem. Happy to be here.

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Angelo Esposito [00:00:58]:

Yeah, so I love. I love your background. Obviously did a little research. I don't just jump into these blind, and you got quite the hospitality background, to put it lightly. But again, I like making these conversational. I'm getting to know you actually, for the first time, face to face. So let's get into it. So maybe just to start off, and then we'll take a step back.

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Angelo Esposito [00:01:15]:

But to start things off, can you tell people just high level, what is the Patina Restaurant Group?

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:01:20]:

Yeah, so we are a collection of restaurants. You could say we do it the hard way. We've got 30 restaurants and 30 concepts, right? So none of the same. So you got to make it different everywhere. We are a restaurant group owned by a large organization, Delaware north. So we are in different business entities. We've got gaming, sports, service, travel, hospitality. So that is airports and casinos and stadiums and these sorts of opportunities.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:01:48]:

But then for us, we have restaurants and our largest restaurants. From a volume standpoint, we have quite a bit of business with Disney in both east and west areas. So the volume is there, which is very fun. But then we have a handful of restaurants in New York, Boston, Southern California. We also do a very large catering event called the PGA of America. So we have that, too. That's a big piece of business for us. So it's very fun.

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Angelo Esposito [00:02:15]:

Wow, that's awesome. Yeah, I think I've been to a few restaurants. One of them, you mentioned Disney. I'm not too long ago, I was at a conference, and I was at one of them that I think was in the. I mean, I'm in Florida. So it was in the Disney Springs area, I think was called Edison's, if I know the Edison.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:02:31]:

Yes.

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Angelo Esposito [00:02:34]:

Yeah. Very cool. Very cool spot. So, yeah, love it. Love it. Cool. So, I mean, look, I always like to understand how people got to where they are. So, first of all, 30 restaurants for people listening.

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Angelo Esposito [00:02:43]:

Most of our listeners are restaurateurs, so they understand the complexity of 30 establishments, period. But then 30 establishments that are all different concepts is exponentially harder. So I'd love to understand, maybe before we get into that, your background. So, like, what got you into hospital in the first place? Right. Like, going back many, many years, what got you into this space?

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:03:05]:

I grew up in this business. My father is a chef, and. And so I kind of always saw pieces of it. And maybe you could say, growing up, I would see those little things that you exposed to when you're in this business. And I was like, oh, I want to do that. That looks like fun. So I started off as a lion cook in San Francisco, which was called San Francisco and 2001, 2000 ish, and kind of grew career from there, and was in the kitchen, came out of the kitchen, got into the bar beverage business, found myself in Grand Cayman for a couple years, landed in New York. Then I joined Danny Balloot's restaurant group, the Dynex Group in New York, was there for quite some time, went back into hotels with Ace Hotel Group, and headed up all have to be for them for quite some time, then joined the larger conglomerate of Barry International.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:04:00]:

From there, fell back into patina with little restaurants. So it's very fun to pop in and out of hotel operations, but I've always kind of seen this growing up, and it's such a fun business, and you have to enjoy what you do. Otherwise, work is just work. So let's have fun.

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Angelo Esposito [00:04:20]:

I love that. So, Olivia, let me ask you. A lot of people listing maybe are also just working in restaurants right now. So maybe not necessarily full on operators or owners, but inspired by seeing your trajectory. Right. You started as a line cook, and now you have vice president at this awesome restaurant group. And so I'd love to hear, like, any. Any advice for those listeners, like, what did that journey look like for you, and any advice to people who maybe want to move, you know, work their way up, let's say, in the restaurant world?

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:04:47]:

Yeah. One is, I was guilty of it. You know, when I was, like, 22, I was like, I can be. I could run a restaurant group. I can do that. Right? And now that I look back on this, I know that I couldn't. You need time, and you need patience, and you need experience, and you need to have a grouping of people that you can learn and lean on. I think to learn from.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:05:13]:

And, you know, for me, I took a couple whims and traveled from San Francisco to Las Vegas, Cayman islands to New York, back to LA. And now I've been to Las Vegas. But then not being afraid to, especially when you're younger, getting into this career, or I could say, you know, younger in actual, when you enter the career, not young in age, but don't be afraid to travel and take a job somewhere that is puts you out of your element because I'd say you, what I learned in two years working at a resort in the Cayman Islands was you can't, can't put money on that. There's only, for many, there's like one time in your life before maybe you are in some sort of relationship or have a child or try do something or you put too many roots down in hospitality. You have the opportunity to travel and it's really cool to do it. You know, do it and you get exposed. Awesome stuff.

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Angelo Esposito [00:06:20]:

That's cool. That definitely a good nugget there. So for people listening, like, don't be, don't be scared to travel, especially when you can and kind of get that experience because I think, you know, to add on to that, another thing I think is super useful and I'd love to hear from your side, but is like, you know, also just not being shy to find mentors. Like, everyone has had a mentor at one point in their life, usually, and including the mentors, the mentors had someone who mentored them. So I'm curious from your experience, right? Like, you know, working in the industry the last 20 plus years, like, what did you have a mentor and what type of things that were you able to kind of, like, learn from your, your mentor or mentors if there's more than one?

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:06:54]:

I think you can learn from those that have positions you see, but you can also learn from those that are thus entering this career and working for Daniel Beluda in New York, he's always been a little bit of a mentor. You could say. He's always been good like that. Yeah, there is. And then there's a couple really special, you could say, you know, direct boxes that have been stuck with me for a very long time. You know, some I followed into new jobs and stayed and they moved on and vice versa, but not being afraid to just ask the question. And I'm very big on, well, if I can't get that job, what do I need to do to get that job? Like, I'm still finding more experience. I need this.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:07:43]:

So I think the biggest thing is one, don't be afraid to have a mentor or to ask the question. And I always put myself out there for any of my people that I meet or anybody. If you want to talk about stuff, let's just talk about it, because that's part of this business and a lot of it is. I know my cousin's friend's uncle's brother is the one that's hiring this random position and, oh, I know somebody who's perfect for that. Right, great, let's connect them and connect those boxes. And I think it goes a really long way. So, yes, mentors, I guess that's my roundabout way of saying mentors. Great how to do it.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:08:22]:

And, you know, it doesn't need to be a formal, like Jedi council in darkness. Mister Miyagi, come on, you can just be like, hey, can you help me with this? The answer should be yes. Otherwise it should be in this business, hospitality.

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Angelo Esposito [00:08:38]:

Yeah. Yeah. I think. I think the key also sometimes just, just remembering that most people that are usually somewhat ahead of you have obviously been where you're at to some extent. And so just remembering that, I think sometimes people are scared to ask. But from my experience, most people actually want to help. Like, if you ask for help, people like, helping people, like giving advice and guiding, and if they've been where you've been, like, you know, there's exceptions, but generally speaking, people are actually pretty helpful and they like feeling useful. And so, like, when you ask for help, it's like, you'll usually get a pretty good response.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:09:09]:

Yeah, it's, you know, rising tide lives all boats.

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Angelo Esposito [00:09:12]:

There you go.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:09:13]:

Successful restaurants. Help. Successful restaurants. And if you're busy and I'm busy, then we both have crowds and people cross pollinate to our bars or all these sorts of things. But, you know, if I'm really busy and you're. And you're not, then it's not good for the area.

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Angelo Esposito [00:09:30]:

Exactly.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:09:31]:

You need to have community and you need to respect that. And when you do or understand that, you know, you don't give away all of your secrets. Sure. But you can definitely get close to it. Yeah, that's okay.

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Angelo Esposito [00:09:44]:

It's funny, I was, I saw something online the other day. It was about startups, but it's probably, it's similar to what you just said about giving away your secrets. And it resonated so much with me, but it was basically saying, like, first time entrepreneurs are usually, like, very secretive. Like, I got this idea, but I can't tell you. And then people have been in the industry so much and have had field business and have done it. They don't care about sharing their idea because they know how much execution is needed and how much has to go. Right. That they're not as tierpoint secretive.

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Angelo Esposito [00:10:13]:

So obviously there's some things maybe you keep secret, but generally speaking, it's like, yeah, you can tell who's a more seasoned entrepreneur or in this case restaurateur because it's like they're not shy to share knowledge because they know knowledge is a piece of it. But executing all that knowledge is the hard part.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:10:30]:

Yeah, I mean we can all google a recipe for something amazing, but actually that's the difference. Right. So there you go. Sharing knowledge or sharing it is a super key piece. Yeah, it's a good way to go. I mean, we all buy many. There's only a handful of like, you want like a really good meat purveyor, right? There's only so many. So just share who it is.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:10:54]:

It's not a big skin.

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Angelo Esposito [00:10:56]:

Well, and speaking of meat, by the way, I was checking, and we'll definitely jump into a bit of the Patina Restaurant Group right now. I was checking. Your website's looking around. So speaking of meat, I think if I'm misquoting correct me, but I think it was top 101 steakhouses, one of your properties in LA. And I, something about the dry aging process. I don't want to butcher it, no pun intended. So please tell us a bit about that because that sounded like a really cool concept, especially being in the top 101 steakhouses. So love to hear about that and what makes it so special.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:11:28]:

Yeah, it said Nick and Steph's in Los Angeles and this landed on this list and it's a great thing to be on. You know, all those from. Whenever you land on a list, it's usually a good thing. As long as you're not just paying for it. Then, you know, there we dry age all of our own beef in house. Probably one of the. There's not many in Los Angeles itself where you're dry aging your own, all of your own beef. Usually you're buying it from somebody.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:11:56]:

Got it. Our shed there, Megan Logan, she's awesome. She's been there almost since the dawn of it and maybe even since the dawn of it and predates me. But, you know, the quality of meat and the quality of steak coming out of that restaurant is amazing. And it's not cool and flashy. Right. There's a lot of that around Los Angeles. You know, we're hop, skipping a jump down from the broad museum.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:12:22]:

And it's. What they're doing is really exceptional. Our program is great, too. Our GM there, Marlene, does an awesome job, and it's just an awesome meal. And I'm a big happy hour guy. I love happy hour. Same good one there, but it's a great. And it's kind of like a hidden gem of Los Angeles.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:12:45]:

We always make those. We make the happy hour list there quite a bit. And locally, that steakhouse list, that usually when those sorts of things come out, we get included that sort of stuff.

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Angelo Esposito [00:12:54]:

That's cool. That's really cool. And, you know, I know there's obviously a ton of other concepts. One thing I'm sure like, people listening that especially have more than one concept or thinking is advice around how do you manage it, right. You have this kind of diverse culinary experiences across different states and different areas. How do you maintain, you know, consistency across such a varied portfolio, trusting and.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:13:22]:

Building relationships for those that are there on site doing it, you know, and can't be everywhere at once.

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Angelo Esposito [00:13:28]:

Yep.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:13:28]:

We need to learn to let go of a little bit of control and to say, I trust you because I've known you now and I see what you can do. So let's keep doing it, and let's see how we can build it even higher together. And that's the team. You know, my success depends on their success, and their success depends on mine. So we are all one together and very inclusive sort of leader, you could say. And that's. That's the way I operate. Yeah, you can really do that.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:13:57]:

Say, I will trust your decision. If you want to do that, let's do it. I support you, and we can live, right? Yes. Italian. We have steakhouses. We have new mexican concept in southern California that's crushing. And there's all kinds of great stuff happening, and it's super cool.

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Angelo Esposito [00:14:16]:

That's awesome. And were you always good at delegating? Because I know it's something that's important, like you said, especially at scale. You can't be in 30 places. There's a million and one things going on. So tell me a bit about that side of it, like, how have you evolved just as a leader and, like, learning a delegate and any advice around that?

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:14:33]:

I was not always a good delegator. I'm very much one to say, let me show you how to do it, then if you can see that I can do it, then you can also learn the way mentor, you could say, and boss once told me, you don't do something just because you think it's. You do it because it's good for the business, it's good for the guests, it's good for the overall thriving of what we're doing. Right.

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Angelo Esposito [00:14:58]:

Right.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:14:59]:

I went on this big rant about, you know, ice once, and I was like, we need clear ice. Why? And, you know, ultimately it does melt slower. So people are drinking more cocktails because you're drinking less water. So there isn't to it. It's not just pretty scientific reason. And when you understand that, and then you're like, oh, versus like, do this because we are trying to help you. If you just. It looks better.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:15:29]:

It doesn't just look better. It serves a purpose. So I always wanted to say, you need to share all details and reasoning for decisions and then let those leaders do it because they'll understand. Why not just do it because we're saying to do it, but do it because it's a good reason.

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Angelo Esposito [00:15:47]:

Right.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:15:48]:

You know, then you can't argue it. Like, well, I guess. I guess I can argue with that. You gotta do it.

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Angelo Esposito [00:15:54]:

That makes sense. And it's funny. It's a subtle difference, but if you just tell someone, at least in my experience, when you just tell someone to do something, it's also just kind of, you become the bottleneck. Because now it's like you got 30 places and you're telling people versus if you empower them, and sure, show them and teach them, ideally they got to be trained properly, etc. But once you kind of empower them, they're telling you what they're doing, and then you're like, cool. Yeah, that makes sense. And it almost becomes like this reverse way of doing things where, like, they're leading now and you're supporting them as the leader. You're supporting them, but they're their own leaders, you know?

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:16:25]:

Yeah. Let me figure out a way to think that our mind or my idea is now your idea.

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Angelo Esposito [00:16:32]:

Exactly.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:16:32]:

And then you can own it.

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Angelo Esposito [00:16:35]:

Exactly.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:16:36]:

You know, I have a three year old son, and he's constantly asking why. Maybe this helps me become a better person because I'm now learning. You explained why before I, you know, assume.

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Angelo Esposito [00:16:51]:

Right. That's hilarious. That's awesome, though, that you're learning. But it's true, though, kids are curious, so. Yeah. Especially that age, three, four years old, you're gonna get a lot of whys. And sometimes the worst part is you don't know the why. You're like, man, that was a good question.

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Angelo Esposito [00:17:03]:

I never thought about that.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:17:05]:

It's very funny, too. It always leads to like, you know, it was like, why is the plant green? Like photosynthesis? But why? Because we need oxygen. But why at a certain point? I don't know.

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Angelo Esposito [00:17:15]:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Then you kind of have existential crisis. You're like, I don't know, why are we here? You know, all prompted by a three year old. But yeah, it's amazing. That's awesome.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:17:26]:

But, you know, I'm very big on show people and leaders and servers and I, and everybody show them the tools and show them why we're doing something instead of just do it. Because somebody in an office thought it was a good idea.

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Angelo Esposito [00:17:44]:

Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:17:45]:

It's a very big key piece. And when you can explain all of that, I think you get better buy in. Unless you have larger delegation because then a couple ideas have been taken in and they're owning it. Now. When you try to say we should just do this, you actually prove it. Everybody jumps on board.

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Angelo Esposito [00:18:01]:

Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:18:01]:

And that's, you know, proof points. It's a great idea. How it's easy.

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Angelo Esposito [00:18:07]:

Yeah, that's awesome. And, you know, being in your role right now, like, what would you say are some, some unique challenges that you face? Like, I know we touched on obviously multiple concepts and delegating any other kind of challenges that come up that you can maybe share with our audience.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:18:25]:

There was a chat and we could say, find new people to do jobs. Sure. But that's life now. It's about how do we be innovative in our industry without just saying, like, we're going to make robots to do the job for us. Because that's not. I'm sure that maybe it's cool in some aspect. Not really, but this is a people person job. This is a people industry.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:18:52]:

We are hospitality, hospitable. You need to be reactive. I think the challenge is that is how to be innovative in a place that is very innovative already. And just because it's innovative, it doesn't mean that it's futuristic or like something that belongs in back to the future we got from that. It's more of like, since the dawn of time, we put a lime wedge on a margarita. But why? If it's ready to drink and it's good, you shouldn't have to do that, you know. Do we typically serve salt on the side of my food? No, because it's been seasoned for you. So I'm very big on questioning things that we've done ever and why are we doing it and we need to continue to do that or can we even push the boundary further and do something different that's interesting.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:19:42]:

I think it's a fun way to think about stuff. It's when you can do that and you can crack that code. It's at a point now I'm totally.

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Angelo Esposito [00:19:52]:

On a different tangent, but anyways, that's super interesting.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:19:56]:

It's a good way to think. And, oh, yes, the challenge. Yes. So the challenge in business is how do you be innovative without just being. Without technology. And the word innovation usually in our business is like technology. Right. It's usually right there.

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Angelo Esposito [00:20:11]:

Right.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:20:12]:

I think there's ways to be innovative and look deeper into what we're usually doing and how do we change that process? Yeah, I tell teams all the time, I don't want you to work harder. I simply want you to look different. And when you think like that, I think it helps a lot from a business case.

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Angelo Esposito [00:20:35]:

It's an interesting perspective because I think you're absolutely right about the idea of, like, generally people think innovation, they think tech. But there's probably a lot of examples of just being innovative without tech. And I'm curious to get your thoughts, like when you think about, for example, you know, where the industry's heading and most people are getting more and more techie, generally speaking, and maybe robot servers and this and drones and whatever, and just getting more and more, implementing more and more tech, where do you see the kind of full service restaurants? Where do you see kind of that future? Because I have my thoughts. I'm curious to hear your thoughts. As things generally, you know, in QSRs and maybe fast casuals, become more and more, I guess, transactional to a certain extent, where do you think the future of FSRs would be heading with all these, you know, technological advances?

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:21:20]:

Maybe just that there will be less of them. I think there is. To have to want a full service restaurant. I want to sit down. I want someone to come and take my order as part of the whole experience, what you're paying for. Sometimes, instead of trying to cut a corner and say you're full service, but you're not, just say you're not and change your service model and adapt to that. You can have very good food in a counter service or like order, take a number, we bring it to you. Yeah, but even that can be very innovative.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:21:54]:

Like, it's not, you're not having a lesser quality product, you're not having a lesser response. You just need to build it into that. And when you say that sort of a thing, not everybody, we can't all have full service restaurants and say, out of ten maybe six will continue and four will actually become a different service level. We have, say, counter service, casual service, full service. Probably going to be a new genre created which is somewhere in the middle of all of that, right? It's not just order at the counter and your food gets dropped, but maybe there is a hybrid where you are ordering in one central place. However, when your food comes to your table, somebody is engaging with you still and you can actually order more from them. Versus here you go. If you want to order something else, you have to go over there or you do it on your phone, which no one wants to do anything.

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Angelo Esposito [00:22:52]:

Right.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:22:52]:

I will retract that. There is one time when you want to order things on your phone. And if you're at a resort and you're sitting in a pool chair and you're like, Margarita right now?

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Angelo Esposito [00:23:02]:

Yeah, that is very true. That is very true. I agree with that. Yeah, it's funny, the ordering. I don't like ordering. This is my personal opinion. I like seeing a menu just because there's more real estate and I like just so I prefer a menu over a phone, like a tiny screen. But if it's like something more transactional, like examples, the end of the night, I can't flag down.

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Angelo Esposito [00:23:26]:

Or if it's like reordering a beer or something more trivial, I find that's where, like, the phone, I don't mind. It's like, oh, you know what? They're busy. I get it. Like, I'm trying to flag someone down. I'd love to just tap my phone and order another beer. I like that use case, but I'm. But I'm with you generally, like, just too much on the phone. It's like, just.

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Angelo Esposito [00:23:41]:

But it's funny. I'm curious to get your thoughts on this. I kind of see it as like a cyclical thing. And it's almost like with fashion and anything else, it's like, you know, I don't know, aviator glasses, you know, are in and then they're not, and then they come back and whatever. Bell bottom jeans. And you kind of just see, like. And even just in life, like, you know, like, living outside of a big city is like how people grew up and then, like, everyone moved to cities and now it's like, kind of cool to like, maybe have a house or something outside of the city. And so you kind of start seeing these, like, trends.

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Angelo Esposito [00:24:11]:

It's almost like a circle. And so when I think about full service at a high level, I agree with you that it's possible thing you know, is maybe trending down, generally speaking, just because it's hard to maintain, let's say, a full service restaurant. But my prediction, I could be way off. But my prediction is, like, as more and more tech and robots and all these things come and people order to their house and take out, they'll actually. The full service will maybe even become more and more valuable because it becomes more of a rarity, more of something that's, like, unique. Right? Like, my parents growing up, there was mainly full service restaurants. Like, so quick service was the new thing on the block. We're like, cool, let me pick up a sandwich and whatever.

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Angelo Esposito [00:24:46]:

But now I feel like, not yet, but my prediction is, as things become more and more robotic and transactional, there may be an opportunity for full service restaurants. Again, it might be a brand in between, like you said, which I think that's a good shout out. But. But I almost feel like that might be an opportunity where people just want that human connection similar to, like, oh, it's cool to, like, now have a farmhouse. It might be cool now to go to the full service restaurant and be like, what do you recommend, Olivier? What's your favorite dish? Like, just missing that human interaction.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:25:16]:

It's a big call out. And, you know, part of what I love about a full service, we in this business, you make decisions throughout the entire day. I go to a restaurant, I don't know one. I don't like to look at a menu ahead of time. I like to look at it when I get there.

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Angelo Esposito [00:25:30]:

Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:25:31]:

Part of the whole thing, the server, it's always, you know, it's always my question. It's like, what do you. What do you like? Because if you. It's your place, you tell me what to get. I don't want it. And it's like, it's usually like, okay, great, done. There is something for that. And, you know, as we do evolve in this business, like you said, there.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:25:52]:

There are things which will be. I mean, that's probably how. No idea how, where and how fast food came to be in life, but this was a genre which did not exist.

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Angelo Esposito [00:26:02]:

Exactly.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:26:03]:

And then it became. Right. So, you know, then, you know, we've also now modified to fast casual. Right. So what is the next. I cannot coin it. I wish I had.

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Angelo Esposito [00:26:15]:

Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:26:15]:

The term that's there, it is, you know, trademark. I don't have it. But there is a different level in between. That's something. And almost, like, working through all of these different ideas, somebody is going to come out of it, and, you know, there is there is a genre for that. Now. Fast food has a little bit of. It could have a negative connotation because it's too fast.

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Angelo Esposito [00:26:42]:

Right.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:26:42]:

So you're making that.

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Angelo Esposito [00:26:44]:

Exactly.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:26:47]:

But there is something in between there which I think can work. And the quality is key, but I don't think anyone is afraid to pay for something if there is value and quality to it. And you just need to be cognitive of what is that quality of value. So if it's level of service, if it's the build out of the space, if it's how food is delivered, there's innovation and creativity to all of that.

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Angelo Esposito [00:27:12]:

No, it makes sense. And how do you balance, like you just said, innovation and creativity, but then with the operational efficiency of your role as well. Right. Because it's like business. You know, restaurants are not easy businesses. They got to be run properly, and margins, and, you know, there's only a few things you can control. So I'm curious to say, like, how do you balance that creativity and innovation with operational efficiency?

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:27:37]:

Well, I think that's some of the, you could say, secret sauce that comes with. Of being in different restaurants and seeing different cultures and seeing different ways things are being done. You know, we have one of our restaurants in Epcot. It's called space 220. You're dining in space, and it is massively busy all the time. And, you know, like, we. We serve anywhere between 80 to 100 old fashions every day.

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Angelo Esposito [00:28:06]:

Wow.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:28:09]:

That's only one of the, you know, ten cocktails. Expectations are very high. There needs to be value. And I can't just skimp on quality or creativity because of the high volume. So we have to find a way to create balance and say, yes, I can hit my cost. Yes, I can hit my price point. Yes, I can hit my production and flavor profile and all of these little things that go into it and make sure that it hits. So, you know, there can't sacrifice quality for quantity.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:28:45]:

Yeah, I think sometimes we, as in this business, do that because you say, well, I can't make 2000 of those every day. You can. You just need to think different and find a way. If I have 2000 guests coming through there and everybody gets one thing, why don't you make a bigger thing? Because they share it. So now you're making a thousand things instead of 2000. And, you know, the hour based on your guests and your needs and question everything, and don't sacrifice quality, because that's how you get torn apart, I think, in reviews or guests coming back and, you know, they can see through, they can see through that.

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Angelo Esposito [00:29:25]:

Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:29:27]:

There are some things, right. I can't make compressed something, but if somebody gives me a very good, like take this and bake it at home, really good. But you know, there are, you know, quality products. You can, you can see through it. So I think also our, your average guest is a lot smarter and they have a lot more, say, accessibility at their fingertips. So if you think you found something to create a shortcut, they're gonna find it and then they're going to know that it's not good.

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Angelo Esposito [00:29:59]:

Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:30:00]:

Or, or it is really good. But you know, maybe you can say. I mean, I always thought that during COVID everyone's home bartending skills became better.

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Angelo Esposito [00:30:11]:

Right.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:30:11]:

So you, we had to up our game within the business.

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Angelo Esposito [00:30:14]:

That's interesting. Right?

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:30:16]:

It's uh, you know, the, yeah. Anyways, that's another.

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Angelo Esposito [00:30:21]:

No, it's spot on. I, I totally get it. It's, it's, it's a mix of like you said, it's like, don't sacrifice, but also you have to run a business because without the business, there is no one to serve and there's no one to staff. And so it's like a fine line. I think that's part of the art. The business of a restaurant is the art in itself because you're like, how do I, to your point, hit that flavor profile and it's priced value driven. So it's, you know, reasonably whatever that means for that place, that location, that proud, whatever. And you know, finding all these things.

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Angelo Esposito [00:30:52]:

And it's, it's one of the things that's personally made me passionate about restaurants in general is that if you think about it, there has to be so many kind of like aha moments, especially in full service, but in general, but especially in full service. And so many things have to go right to like have a good time. And it's crazy when you think about it because like, was the parking easy? Did I get greeted by the hostess? Well? Did I, was that first drink good? Did I have to wait to get my first glass of water? Was the food good? Did I have to wait like. And what's crazy if is one thing is off. It's like that someone has a negative perception. It could be I waited too long for the bill. But how was the food? Amazing. How's the drink? Amazing.

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Angelo Esposito [00:31:30]:

How's parking? Easy. How's the place? I love it, but I had to wait for the bill. What do they remember? That they had to wait for the bill, which is such a stressful part. But I think that's why I have such a respect for restaurant operators, because you need so many things to go. Right. For someone to leave and be like, yeah, I'd recommend that place. And it's like that little sentence. There was like 13 things that had to go, right.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:31:49]:

Yeah, it's true. And sometimes we'll go through, like, what is the guest journey to your place? Right. And parking and entry and how do you find it? This could be a major barrier that you'll never win. And you just like, that's part of it. So taking those things and all of that into consideration, how easily you can get in and out of your restaurant. But food could be amazing. Your service could be unreal. Parking sucks.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:32:18]:

It's not good.

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Angelo Esposito [00:32:19]:

Right. And it could be the smallest thing, you know, down to the attitude of the server. You can have an amazing night because you have the coolest server, and then the opposite is true, too. The food could be good, everything. But the server was a bit rude. And you're kind of, like, caught off guard and you're like, ah, I'm not going back there. And you're like, well, this sucks.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:32:36]:

If you had the opportunity to travel and be in this industry to take it and to do it.

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Angelo Esposito [00:32:40]:

Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:32:41]:

And to get exposed to other things, you know, I'd say that I've worked at a couple of resorts in my life.

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Angelo Esposito [00:32:46]:

Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:32:46]:

And it's a funny thing because you, if you're at, you know, a diner around the corner from your house, a little local mom and pop shop.

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Angelo Esposito [00:32:54]:

Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:32:55]:

Great. You've got neighborhood people and they're going through all of what you just described.

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Angelo Esposito [00:33:01]:

Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:33:01]:

Part of these things every day.

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Angelo Esposito [00:33:03]:

Right.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:33:03]:

There be a couple times a week and the regulars. And it's like a cheers situation. So then you have the resort where if you don't deliver on dinner, you haven't ruined their dinner, you ruin the vacation.

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Angelo Esposito [00:33:19]:

The vacation. Yeah. That's pressure because you have a new.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:33:22]:

Low every week when you're in dining experiences or restaurant experiences that are beyond neighborhood places. But if you're part of a destination or part of a larger experience or you're doing someone's wedding. Right. Or something.

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Angelo Esposito [00:33:36]:

Right, right.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:33:37]:

And so expectations are even higher.

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Angelo Esposito [00:33:40]:

Right.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:33:42]:

I say this because taking this mindset in, and then how do you really do guest recovery. Right. It's such a key piece. And unfortunately, we live in a space where a lot of guests will not tell you anything. They'll go home and then they'll rip you online.

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Angelo Esposito [00:34:01]:

It's the worst.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:34:02]:

They're afraid of confrontation or they're afraid that the answer, which you get might not be what you hear. And there is this, you know, we always will say, you know, managers have to touch tables. Right? This is true. And how awkward is sometimes it can be when someone comes by, how are you enjoying everything today? You know, working that into your service element is key. And getting that validation or, or being approachable to hear feedback at the moment, but then do something about it at the moment.

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Angelo Esposito [00:34:35]:

Yes.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:34:36]:

It's so key in the success of this business. Right. Because, you know, like you said, if you check one of those boxes wrong, you could lose a guest for life. And they'll tell ten friends.

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Angelo Esposito [00:34:45]:

Exactly. Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:34:46]:

It's the worst part, really connecting with every table. And it's something that I think that I always highlight. The mom and pop restaurant where the owner is there at the door knows you when you walk in, knows everybody. Somebody walks in and it's like, oh, you're here for the thing you like. There's something to that. Versus sometimes managers are afraid to talk to people.

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Angelo Esposito [00:35:10]:

Yeah, it's true.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:35:13]:

I always question, how do you incentivize your managers, how you get them to stay and how do you get them to own it like it's theirs. Right. You give somebody a yearly bonus. Maybe that worked ten years ago. What about every six months you get a bonus based on how long you're staying and how your performance is. Right. Even though it's the same amount of money, it's just you're doing it faster.

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Angelo Esposito [00:35:35]:

Yes.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:35:35]:

So keep managers to manage and talking to guests, it's so key. Because that's full service.

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Angelo Esposito [00:35:42]:

Yeah.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:35:43]:

It's not just server, it's also management engagement.

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Angelo Esposito [00:35:46]:

Yeah, I think you nailed it. Keeping employee morale high, keeping the managers motivated, which is not easy, but there's an art to that too. And if you could keep them motivated, ultimately it trickles down to the guests. And even sometimes, to your point, it's not just like the what, but it's like the how. So? Like, maybe someone might, a manager might come out and say, like, everything okay here? And, like, as they're walking away, like, of course I'm not going to complain in that moment, but if someone comes around, says, hey, I noticed you didn't eat too much of that salmon there. Everything okay? I will respond. You know, so there's also the art of the how, not just the what, because someone could check it off and say, yeah, I went to every table. I said, how's it going?

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:36:21]:

Like we say, it's based on what is your hospitality. If you're a neighborhood spot, right. There's ways to talk into it. If you're in a distribution, there's so many ways to get into that. Right? Where are you here from? First question, easy. Yeah. And then you can get into, oh, you only ate two bites of your fish. Why? How's everyone?

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Angelo Esposito [00:36:44]:

Yeah. Yeah. Next table. Yeah, it's interesting. That's what I love about the space is, like, such an art and science, you know, like, yes, it's a business, and then it's all about numbers, but those numbers are related to so many things that are, like, qualitative things, which is interesting. Just. Just switching gears and just kind of, you know, wrap it up. I'd love to know, like, what does the future look like? What exciting projects or maybe expansions, if you can share.

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Angelo Esposito [00:37:08]:

If it's private, you don't have to, but if there's a anything you could share of exciting projects or expansions on the horizon. For the Patina Restaurant Group, we are.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:37:16]:

Launching an American Rosserie concept. And so we're getting, you know, buildings, a couple different street side restaurants, which is fantastic for us. And they will be the first brand that we launch and create that is built for multiple locations for the same brand. So we're finally learning a little bit, which is one that's awesome, you know, so that's. That is exciting. You know, we just, we just launched Sayo, Centrico and Tiendita, which is our three in one concept at downtown Disney in Anaheim, California, with chef Carlos Gaiten. So we'd like to expand that relationship more with him and door Disney wherever we can. But there's, you know, the street side restaurant, american grasseries.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:38:04]:

There's a couple things there in the hopper, which are great, but that's a big one for us. Apparently, we're going to invent something between casual and full service restaurants also.

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Angelo Esposito [00:38:14]:

I can't wait. That's going to be cool. A whole new category. And you're probably right, there will be a whole new category. So it'll be exciting to look back at this one day and be like, oh, found it. This is the name that they came up with. It's called. I don't know, I can't think of anything.

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Angelo Esposito [00:38:29]:

It's hard to come up with a name on the spot of, no, that's awesome. And last but not least, I like that. Maybe, like, just on a more personal note, two quick ones. One is just what has been the most rewarding part of your career so far.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:38:39]:

You know, I think it is watching teams around me grow and watching their success as well build. Right. And I still talk to many managers, many servers, bartenders, et cetera, that have grown since I worked with them. And we easily stay connected. As one thing about, you can say social media or other things, we watch each other grow, and it's fun to be like, remember when we did this restaurant a while ago and look at us now, you know? So that's cool, you know, looking back on those memories, and I think it's really nice. Also, I will re emphasize yet again, travel while you can. Go. Go do crazy things because you won't regret it.

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Angelo Esposito [00:39:29]:

I love that. It's funny. That was actually going to be, my other question was going to be to wrap up, what advice would you give to aspiring restaurateurs? So one is travel while you can. Anything else you want to throw in there?

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:39:40]:

Don't be afraid to take a risk on an idea. If you. The worst thing that can happen is you just got to change it back to what it was before, right? That is how you can define innovation or success.

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Angelo Esposito [00:39:55]:

I love that. And then finally, last but not least, I always like to just kind of plug our guests any way we can. So really just a chance. We're going to put it in the description in the episode as well. But if you want to share your website, the Patina restaurant website, your LinkedIn, whatever you want to share, you can just drop it now. We'll also put in the links, but if you want to share anything, the floor is yours.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:40:15]:

We've said some of the places we operate through out here, you know, if you give us the Google Latina restaurant group, we got a new website coming. It's a little dated, I will admit that. But, you know, there's some fun things there to discover, as well as with Delaware north as a larger organization, there's some really things we're doing, and it's not just in the US, you know, also UK, Australia, and a few other places. So also, don't be shy. You ever just want to chat, I'm here. You can find me. It's not hard.

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Angelo Esposito [00:40:46]:

That's awesome. And if you want to connect with you on LinkedIn, at least give them your name. So spell it out. Olivier Rassinoux. Rassinoux is r a s s i n o u x. Is that okay? If I'm plugging that LinkedIn, follow Olivier on LinkedIn.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:41:04]:

Reach out. Cool, cool, cool, cool.

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Angelo Esposito [00:41:06]:

I love that. Amazing. Well, look, Olivier, wealth and knowledge is honestly super cool to talk to. You just seem like a generally cool and fun guy, so it was nice to connect and just hear about your experience. And once again, we're here with Olivier Rassinoux, vice president of Patina Restaurant Group. Thanks for joining us today.

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Olivier Rassinoux [00:41:23]:

Thanks again. Thanks for having me.

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Angelo Esposito [00:41:25]:

Feel free to check out WISK.ai for more resources and schedule a demo with one of our product specialists to see if it's a fit for.

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